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  • #76
    Originally posted by Buckeyefan80 View Post
    Demonrats, Killary, Do-Nothing Democrats, Crazy Joe, Mini Mike, Nervous Nancy, Crooked Hillary....I can spout out childish nicknames like I'm 6 too as opposed to having a civilized conversation. SMH

    t seems that all the people commenting must have money flowing in by the truckload. Well, not every person in this country has that luxury. $1200, which I doubt everyone has even received, is not getting everyone by. There are so many issues with unemployment and that clusterfuck not everyone has an income right now. Kids still need fed and parents need money to be able to do that. This is not just about the economy that some narrow minded people think or would have you to think. This is about people surviving. COVID has been around long enough that we know the precautions needed to help slow the spread. There is no reason people cannot go to work and make a living and use the precautions we have been given by your infamous Fauci. If precautions didn't work why do we not hear about all the essential workers getting sick and dying??? Will there be more deaths when state's re-open? Sure. Will they all be COVID related? Highly unlikely. Will there be a huge influx of people to the hospitals? Shouldn't be if they are using the precautions we've been told. I find it interesting Fauci knows for sure there will be a second wave this fall/winter, (kinda like he knew there would be a surprise infectious disease outbreak during Trump's presidency) when we haven't seen swine flu or SARS come back after their outbreaks. That guy seems to know a lot about the future...

    One thing many people aren't realizing is we as a nation are mentally unstable whether you want to admit it or not. There have been more layoff-related deaths like suicide and drug overdoses than confirmed COVID deaths. Of course, these deaths should absolutely be counted as COVID deaths, considering we count someone with "symptoms" as COVID related and the fact that had this pandemic not occurred they most certainly wouldn't have committed suicide or OD'd <--(using the same logic that symptoms automatically mean you have COVID). When lockdown deaths exceed COVID deaths it seems like a pretty good time to let people out before losing their damn minds. It's funny that people can go to the grocery stores and home depot and walmart apparently don't have to worry about getting it. It's only those that go to small businesses and restaurants and hair salons that get infected. If you're willing to give up your freedoms because the government said so, that's your choice. It's also everyone else's choice NOT to give up their freedoms! If they want to go about their day and take the chance of getting infected, that's THEIR choice. If you want to stay in your house and not do anything, that's YOUR choice. That's the great part of living in this country, CHOICE (or at least what we think is choice anymore). People shaming other people because they don't think the way we do is exactly what they want, to keep Americans divided because they know that's the only way they can control us and the media has done their part in accomplishing this.

    Don't forget the fact that while we are all in lockdown, the only thing it is doing to our immune system is making it weaker, which means once this lockdown is over we are going to more easily susceptible to getting sick from anything.

    As Benjamin Franklin stated, "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
    Name-calling, and fact-denial seem to go hand in hand. At other sites where I post reported numbers on Covid 19 – the data is roundly despised as “fiction” and I’m called a “fear-mongering-lying-lib” and “just-another-tool-of-the-fake-media”, and a lot worse besides. I’ll admit, I’m guilty of name-calling as well, but only when I’m trying shake someone into facing the realities of Covid 19 – not the fantasies they’re spinning. It seldom works – LOL – but unless the reality of this disease (its persistence, infectiousness, and lethality) is faced squarely, what you call “lockdown deaths” (a good name) will only be exacerbated. Not for nothing is the president and many of the governors of “reopening” states, not following Fauci’s and the CDC’s guidelines; a choice was made that the risks posed to workers and their families – was worth an economic restart. Now, I’m not judging that choice, at all – America, with 30,000,000 unemployed is facing a friggin depression - but I’ll call out as “stupid” anyone announcing that it’s a safe environment to return because it flat out isn’t.

    Comment


    • Buckeyefan80
      Buckeyefan80 commented
      Editing a comment
      See, it's not difficult to have a conversation without name calling. Another thing is how you can decide what you believe and I, or anyone else, can decide what I believe. Name calling will absolutely do the opposite of what your intentions are, changing someone's mind. I realize the realities of COVID. I take in all the information on both sides and make a decision of what I believe. I realize that there is no vaccine or "cure" and I realize most all deaths are not much different than seasonal flu, such as elderly and people with underlying conditions. Yes, there are healthy people dying from it as well, but I don't know if the numbers match the hysteria and forcing everyone to give up their liberties and freedom. With a 95+% recovery rate, it just seems like what is going on may not be worth it, granted the lockdown may or may not have something to do with it, depending on what side you believe. The county I live in has around 122,000 people and has had 2 deaths. Both were over 50 and had underlying conditions. That is a .0016% chance of dying from this here. I understand it is different in places like NY and whatnot and I understand it seems to be a lot more infectious than other viruses. Contrary to what the President and some other people believe, he does not have the authority to shut down or open up any states. Knowing what we know about it, there really shouldn't be any reason we can't take the proper precautions and get people back to work, because you are correct - it is not as safe as some may have us believe, but we also cannot be so afraid it and take precautions. Those that don't want to take the chance, don't have to go out.

  • #77
    Oregon’s Supreme Court overruled the Governor’s orders about shutting down until September. This could be good news for the OSU-Oregon matchup happening if they have a season.

    Comment


    • #78
      The best news I’ve heard in while.
      https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/2020...ive-in-october
      Everything has to go right, of course; the vaccine has to work, and then there’s its manufacture and wide distribution; but, if all goes well, there still might be an, albeit shortened, NFL season.
      Plus - people will stop dying of this shit.

      Comment


      • Seahawk Rick
        Seahawk Rick commented
        Editing a comment
        The chances of a vaccine before the end of the year are vary close to zero, and the manufacturing and distribution of one, IFFF there ever is one,, will take a great deal of time. NFL gets played with no fans but who knows how long a season runs as players/coaches/staff will get Covid.

      • Buckeyefan80
        Buckeyefan80 commented
        Editing a comment
        I agree that we won’t see a vaccine this year. It’s crazy to think they had one within four months back in 1968. Wonder what changed 🤔

      • Seahawk Rick
        Seahawk Rick commented
        Editing a comment
        I haven't read much on 1968 but do know that vaccines are tough to come up with no matter the disease. I think a treatment will come first to help the people hit hardest by it live instead of die, but after that, I can't bet on next year or next decade when a vaccine will happen for Covid. Like the flu, we will eventually have to get used to living with it, but at the moment it's a monster that isn't done devastating the World...And winter's coming, normal is a mirage...For now.

    • #79
      Originally posted by WJCJR View Post
      The best news I’ve heard in while.
      https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/2020...ive-in-october
      Everything has to go right, of course; the vaccine has to work, and then there’s its manufacture and wide distribution; but, if all goes well, there still might be an, albeit shortened, NFL season.
      Plus - people will stop dying of this shit.
      The thing is, people will still die from it for years even with a vaccine, just like they do every other flu season with every other strain of flu with vaccinations. There still is no vaccine for SARS or MERS and we go on with life as normal. South Korea did a study that shows survivors that gets it again, they do not spread it so there will be millions of non contagious people. It’s been proven that certain age groups and people are more susceptible to death. Those are the people that need to stay home if we want to save lives, not healthy people. The healthy are recovering at a phenomenally high rate(over 99%) so there is no reason they should be forced to stay home. No one should be forced to regardless.

      Comment


      • WJCJR
        WJCJR commented
        Editing a comment
        Well, I meant they’d “stop dying” at the current rate their dropping today. You and Seahawk Rick are sure buzzkills.

      • Seahawk Rick
        Seahawk Rick commented
        Editing a comment
        Just trying to live in reality WJC! ;-) I want everything to get better as fast as it can for the World, let alone sports, but I'm not gonna roll with everything sports teams want to do and think everything is just gonna be fine. I think sports can start again, but what are the odds a few guys on a team get Covid, and then others on the team think they're gonna get it and refuse to play...A chunk of them have families and don't want to take it home to them. All the testing and distancing in the world isn't gonna keep some players on every team from getting it. The odds are against a bunch of teams with all the personnel involved to make the teams run getting through a schedule of games without at least one team coming a part at the seams once a few guys players get Covid. I hope it doesn't happen, and everything can workout, but it's hard to think that it's likely to happen. Baseball says they'll take 'positive' players off the team, well, as we all know, that player might have infected other players or staff.

        Golf and tennis can work...But the team sports seem like a long shot to get through a schedule. I applaud them for trying, and hope to be very wrong about my opinion...

        Opening up too fast is already raising infection numbers in all the states that have let off the brake the most, young, middle aged,and old can get it, and as Buckeye says, the younger you are, the better chance you have of getting through it, but younger people have died from it too. Poll after poll say a big majority of Americans don't want things opening up too fast and are not going to be rushing out to live like we did in January anything soon. All the idiot protesters with their long guns, not wearing masks,organized by various right-wing leaning groups want to have the freedom to go out and infect anyone they're around. I go out and do a lot of things but I keep my space, and wear my mask when I go into a business to protect other people. A small red hat wearing sliver of the population thinks their freedom has been taken away by people trying to save lives in big numbers. They can't drive 100 mph on the roads or drive drunk, they can't set backyard/campsite fires during dry periods in the summer/fall, they can't make bombs in their homes, they can't dump chemicals into water ways, does all that take their freedom away? Covidiots.

        Mers and Sars are both Coronaviruses with each killing under 900 people in the U.S. Both haven't come back, and Mers was rare to spread from human-to-human and was animal based from what I've read. Comparing them to Covid-19 is a non-starter in how infectious the three are. The flu kills 20-30-40,000 a season, even with a vaccine, that everyone doesn't get. It will be around forever, and Covid 19 might too. Nobody knows. The thing is Covid can kill another 50-100,000 people by the end of the year. Just a little more serious huh Buck? We'll have to learn to live with it most likely, but at this point there is so much not known about it, that going back to anything close to normal is like messing with the brakes on Indy cars...Big wreaks will keep happening costing many more lives. We'll never know the true number as Donzilla is trying to squelch the real numbers and not help the states with testing to keep the totals down as more tests mean higher numbers. Businesses can open up again if they do it smart, and abide by the rules set down by the scientists. I want things to open and not kill the economy completely, but I want it to happen in a way keeps the death count down as low as possible.

        OK, I'll stop WJC! I don't think I can be much more of a buzzkill!
        Last edited by Seahawk Rick; 05-19-2020, 07:28 PM.

      • WJCJR
        WJCJR commented
        Editing a comment
        You’re right, of course. It’s just that staring at the ugly reality of Covid 19 every day, that article on the vaccine, for a while, popped me out of being such a mope-head. Also “Covidiots” is the perfect term to described the legion of fact-deniers out there, demanding more and greater “reopening” now.

    • #80
      How badly has Trump botched the response to the covid-19 pandemic? The USA has 4% of the world's population and 30% of the deaths due to covid-19 corona virus. Trump is directly responsible to a great proportion of the excessive deaths.






      Comment


      • Buckeyefan80
        Buckeyefan80 commented
        Editing a comment
        Honest question here Rick, what was he supposed to do? Shut down the borders (which he’s been trying to do to illegals and is being called racist for it, but it was totally cool for Obama to do it 👌), incoming flights, and any mode of travel and shut people off from their families, and be called racist like he was when he tried to stop travelers from China? Was he supposed to urge Governor’s to close down their states in late Feb when Pelosi was telling people to come to Chinatown and eat and shop, even though most people can agree it was already in the US? He would’ve been crucified as a racist and bigot and anyone that denies that is delusional. That’s all he’s been called since the media brainwashed so many people. I will not defend most of his actions, because he is a fuck, but the left hounds on his every move even if it is right.

        He does not have the authority to tell Governor’s what to do in their state’s, which is why he “put it all on the state’s to deal with.” So I ask, what was he supposed to do? Be labeled a racist again bu his haters and “save lives” as some people think would’ve happened or take advice from medical professionals and “wait too late” to shut things down and get roasted by his haters. What would you have done tarb?

        Is he directly responsible for the roughly 5,000 NY nursing home deaths and let Cuomo totally off the hook? Since ya know, he obviously could’ve shut down anyone coming into the US and we would’ve apparently been almost the only nation in the world without a single case. 🙄

        People don’t want to realize just how many power players (Pelosi, McConnell, Schumer, Biden, Graham, etc.) have been in Congress for decades (while becoming millionaires!) and shit has only gotten worse, but let’s blame EVERY SINGLE THING WRONG on 1 person that has been there 3 years. That’s fair and logical.

      • Buckeyefan80
        Buckeyefan80 commented
        Editing a comment
        Also, since there is nothing that can be done about what happened in the past, we sure be worrying about what can be done from here on out. No sense in looking in the rear view mirror. We need to be looking through the windshield. It'll probably help your mood and your BP.

      • Buckeyefan80
        Buckeyefan80 commented
        Editing a comment
        Very easy to say after the fact as well. I hadn’t seen anyone post what should’ve been done BEFORE anything was done. If I missed it, please share.

        That’d be like posting your play before the game starts instead of talk about how much of a winner you are by posting AFTER the game was over...

    • #81
      Well, to start with, he should have sounded the alarm and immediately started testing, instead of telling the people that it is FALSE NEWS spreaded by the media. He totally mishandled the situation, actually denying that the coronavirus was a very dangerous thing. He will go down as the absolutely WORST PRESIDENT of the USA in history.

      Comment


      • Buckeyefan80
        Buckeyefan80 commented
        Editing a comment
        I thought he had the same info the WHO and Fauci and the CDC had, and took his recommendations from Fauci and CDC? They all reported that China didn't disclose the info I thought??? Idk, I can't stand to hear him or any of them spew their lies, so I don't listen to them. When was it the alarm should've been sounded, out of curiosity? Like a small date range would suffice. I have proof of many left wing news media outlets saying it isn't as deadly or worrisome as seasonal flu. Was that FALSE NEWS? Very curious how testing was going to happen when there were nowhere near enough available? No one thought it dangerous in the beginning, and honestly still isn't as dangerous as people and the media is making it out to be, unless you are in of the susceptible categories.

    • #82
      "Just trying to live in reality WJC! ;-) I want everything to get better as fast as it can for the World, let alone sports, but I'm not gonna roll with everything sports teams want to do and think everything is just gonna be fine. I think sports can start again, but what are the odds a few guys on a team get Covid, and then others on the team think they're gonna get it and refuse to play...A chunk of them have families and don't want to take it home to them. All the testing and distancing in the world isn't gonna keep some players on every team from getting it. The odds are against a bunch of teams with all the personnel involved to make the teams run getting through a schedule of games without at least one team coming a part at the seams once a few guys players get Covid. I hope it doesn't happen, and everything can workout, but it's hard to think that it's likely to happen. Baseball says they'll take 'positive' players off the team, well, as we all know, that player might have infected other players or staff.

      Golf and tennis can work...But the team sports seem like a long shot to get through a schedule. I applaud them for trying, and hope to be very wrong about my opinion..."

      These are def things that will be looked at who knows what will come of it. I think we all hope your opinion is wrong, all for the right reasons. LMEAO


      "Opening up too fast is already raising infection numbers in all the states that have let off the brake the most, young, middle aged,and old can get it, and as Buckeye says, the younger you are, the better chance you have of getting through it, but younger people have died from it too. Poll after poll say a big majority of Americans don't want things opening up too fast and are not going to be rushing out to live like we did in January anything soon. All the idiot protesters with their long guns, not wearing masks,organized by various right-wing leaning groups want to have the freedom to go out and infect anyone they're around. I go out and do a lot of things but I keep my space, and wear my mask when I go into a business to protect other people. A small red hat wearing sliver of the population thinks their freedom has been taken away by people trying to save lives in big numbers. They can't drive 100 mph on the roads or drive drunk, they can't set backyard/campsite fires during dry periods in the summer/fall, they can't make bombs in their homes, they can't dump chemicals into water ways, does all that take their freedom away? Covidiots."

      I thought we already talked about name-calling...it does nothing. The thing is, are the "covidiots" the people that believe quarantining and social distancing will actually save lives like our totally truthful govt is telling us, or are they the ones that believe there was a huge overreaction since the recovery rate really hasn't justified the shutdown? If the people that don't want things opening up don't want to go out, they have the choice to not go out. Please help me understand why that is so hard to understand. If young people or people not susceptible want to take the chance then why not let them? If they get it and die, that was their choice. If they get it and live, they will have the immunity.

      What people
      don't realize, for whatever eason, is that of course there is going to be a jump in numbers when people get out and about around each other, especially with lowered immune systems, plus they are testing so many more people. It's inevitable. This would be the time when the susceptible people stay at home. What would the real numbers look like if not for all the nursing home deaths due to irresponsibility? Probably closer to normal flu numbers, yet still higher. It seems more and more people are opening their eyes to this farce every day, luckily.

      Mers and Sars are both Coronaviruses with each killing under 900 people in the U.S. Both haven't come back, and Mers was rare to spread from human-to-human and was animal based from what I've read. Comparing them to Covid-19 is a non-starter in how infectious the three are. The flu kills 20-30-40,000 a season, even with a vaccine, that everyone doesn't get. It will be around forever, and Covid 19 might too. Nobody knows. The thing is Covid can kill another 50-100,000 people by the end of the year. Just a little more serious huh Buck? We'll have to learn to live with it most likely, but at this point there is so much not known about it, that going back to anything close to normal is like messing with the brakes on Indy cars...Big wreaks will keep happening costing many more lives. We'll never know the true number as Don(fixed it for ya) is trying to squelch the real numbers and not help the states with testing to keep the totals down as more tests mean higher numbers. Businesses can open up again if they do it smart, and abide by the rules set down by the scientists. I want things to open and not kill the economy completely, but I want it to happen in a way keeps the death count down as low as possible.

      I wonder why neither of these came back...
      I am not comparing them to COVID even in regards to infectious. Just stating facts. I can compare it to the 1957 and 1968 flu pandemics, as those were just as infectious. Is it REALLY more serious when taking everything into consideration? Let's throw out the fact that the numbers are not going to be accurate because cases were missed in the beginning and cases could be incorrectly counted due to CDC guidelines of counting suspected cases. In the 1957 flu pandemic the death per capita was roughly 6.77, in 1968 pandemic it was around 4.98, and so far COVID is coming in at 2.8. For this to overtake the 1968 flu it would need to become the second most deadly flu since the beginning of the 20th century. At the rate the counting is going now it will easily become the second most deadly flu in America.
      Does anyone know what those would have in common? Answer: the only 2 flu pandemics where the people practiced social distancing and large gatherings were banned as well as closing certain businesses. Sound familiar??? One can easily argue the closings and social distancing is for sure working, but if it becomes the second most deadly flu pandemic in America, is it? Really? I know it may sound morbid to some, but why are we going to continue to keep things closed for a 2.8 death rate? I don't know about everywhere in America, so I can't speak to any of that, but in the County I live in drug overdose is up 50% from same time last year, while suicide is up 11% and domestic abuse reports are up 30%. So again, is it REALLY worth it? If you add all the car accidents that normally would've occurred into your normal flu numbers, I'd guess they are comparable.

      Comment


      • #83
        Originally posted by [B
        Buckeyefan80 [/B]I thought we already talked about name-calling...it does nothing. The thing is, are the "covidiots" the people that believe quarantining and social distancing will actually save lives like our totally truthful govt is telling us, or are they the ones that believe there was a huge overreaction since the recovery rate really hasn't justified the shutdown? If the people that don't want things opening up don't want to go out, they have the choice to not go out. Please help me understand why that is so hard to understand. If young people or people not susceptible want to take the chance then why not let them? If they get it and die, that was their choice. If they get it and live, they will have the immunity.

        What people[/B] [B]don't realize, for whatever eason, is that of course there is going to be a jump in numbers when people get out and about around each other, especially with lowered immune systems, plus they are testing so many more people. It's inevitable. This would be the time when the susceptible people stay at home. What would the real numbers look like if not for all the nursing home deaths due to irresponsibility? Probably closer to normal flu numbers, yet still higher. It seems more and more people are opening their eyes to this farce every day, luckily.
        Okay – no nasty name-calling, but given your strong belief that “quarantining and social distancing” apparently doesn’t “actually save lives”, I think calling you, at the very least, a “common sense-denier” is pretty darn accurate. Nevermind that its demonstrable that social-distancing halts the spread of Covid 19, and just setting aside all those numbers you won’t accept as accurate – tell me how your heroic and death-defying “young” person, will fail to infect others, when the Covid 19 Ro (reproduction number) stands now 2.5-3.5 – which is a few of his pals, who in turn infect their girlfriends, and then all their parents, as well as the caregivers who will treat them. Do you think Covid 19 is less infectious than the flu (Ro 2-3) or less deadly? Or will they all survive by magic? My doctor tells me that the reality of my recurring skin cancer has to be faced because you can’t “pray it away” and that’s true of this pandemic as well. The reality of Covid 19 infectiousness and lethality has to be faced which, despite the thoughtless urging of “common-sense-deniers” (and you are not alone), Americans have done pretty well thus far. It may not seem like it, given that American dead number about 30% of the World’s Covid 19 death total, but that’s mostly down to March and April numbers, while Trump diddled, dithered, denied, and thought blaming China, the media, the WHO, and Obama, would be the best way handle this “ordinary flu”. Americans, and most governors, responded with common sense approaches, which included government lockdowns, economic shutdowns and social distancing orders – which limited spread and saved lives, regardless of your beliefs; and, without that action, Americans would, today, be living the nightmare of Brazil, Sweden and the UK.

        Comment


        • Seahawk Rick
          Seahawk Rick commented
          Editing a comment
          Columbia University put out a study today that said IF in the U.S. Social Distancing had been put into effect ONE WEEK earlier in March, 36,000 lives would have been saved. Our President thought it would go away like a miracle...Fake News.

          An AP Poll out today says 83% of Americans are very concerned opening up too early will lead to a rise in cases.

          WHO said 100,000 new cases were reported today, the most in one day since this all started.

          IF we had started stay at home and doing social distancing the first week of March, Columbia University says about 54,000 fewer people would have died...

          THIS illustrates how much worse it would be right now if we didn't start stay at home and social distancing when we did. The big brains don't make this crap up...But please, lets open it all up now and don't worry about what happens! The Covidiots have all the answers, just NONE of the PHD's to back them up. FREE to infect! Texas and Floriduuuuuh are the leaders among many others. Open, but do it at a walk, not the 100-meter dash!
          Last edited by Seahawk Rick; 05-21-2020, 07:09 PM.

        • Buckeyefan80
          Buckeyefan80 commented
          Editing a comment
          I never said social distancing and quarantining isn’t saving lives. I’m saying the argument is probably actually moot because we will probably never know which way would’ve worked better. Maybe when said and done the fact that there was a country that was a bit more relaxed on the “rules,” we can compare data and come to a real conclusion, who knows. You nor I can say which was common sense at the time, but we can for sure say, knowing the majority of whom it affects we can use common sense now and protect those that are the more susceptible bunch and not keep people with a 99%+ recovery rate in lockdown and destroy lives and the economy. No doubt distancing mitigates the spread but when healthy people easily recover you don’t necessarily need to wait on a vaccine. Everyone just needs to be more sanitary and cautious for the susceptible groups. It would be more of a natural herd immunity and could take its course before a vaccine is ever produced.

          I was a proponent of the whole social distancing and stay at home stuff in the beginning. Wasn’t against the lockdown. Especially with a girlfriend that could possibly be in the susceptible category with her lung condition, but when things just start not adding up and new information becomes available, it’s easy for me and anyone with “common sense” to distinguish between right and wrong. Why is it ok to go to Home Depot, where there are big groups of people but small businesses can’t stay open with only 2 or 3 people in them? That just does not make sense. I believed in all this when it started. Im also a very reasonable and logical person that can think for themselves. I take in all the information and make my own decisions and come to my own conclusions, not what my govt/media is telling me. I look at what the media/government is saying, and I know how to call out bullshit instead of believing everything they tell me.

          It’s honestly hard to tell if it is more “infectious” because during a normal flu season before this year when most people went to the Dr they didn’t always test for flu. You told them your systems, theyd say probably the flu and theyd prescribe a zpak and youd be on your way. No testing required. If they tested every single case of the flu in prior years I would be willing to bet those numbers would be astronomical as well. There are also a lot of people, although positive, showing no symptoms of COVID that are getting tested, which contributes to higher confirmed cases.

          By the numbers it appears to be more deadly, but I have a hard time trusting the numbers when it is speculation that some people died FROM COVID instead of WITH COVID. Also, not all countries are recording numbers the same way. China has to be extremely low, while the US, whether right or wrong, is counting everyone with symptoms and not positive tests. Who knows, the worldwide numbers may be extremely low and in that case I may be very wrong, or they could be just right. 🤷‍♂️ It’s been shown that 99% of Italy’s deaths had preexisting conditions and 96% of them were over the age of 60. In Sweden, which didn’t completely shut down and lived a mostly normal life 95% of their deaths are people 60 and over. 98% are 50 and over so it’s not hard to figure out who should be on lockdown and who doesn’t need to be. So to say they are living a nightmare is ignorant or illogical, I don’t know which. They seem to be pretty happy to be able to go about their life. From the statistics out there I’ve seen if people with preexisting conditions and /or over the age of 60 were to “stay out of the public” if you will, the number of deaths from this would very minimal.

          Of course the parameters put in place limited the spread, at the time. But we will never know if that ACTUALLY saved lives due to COVID. If we didn’t lock down and social distance it could’ve run its course instead of probably having another big outbreak when things open back up. We all know it’s coming and we all know the media and govt will put the fear back in those that can’t think for themselves. Wouldn’t be surprised if there was another shutdown. Maybe this time until there are no viruses left in the world. 🙄 Of course there are going to be more infections as people get back to life. That’s just common sense, but there is no reason to overreact. You can also attribute the high numbers partly to having more tests available. Like I said, there are more flu cases every year than reported. Not everyone goes to the Dr. People see this big number of deaths and the media spins it to fear monger individuals instead of looking at all the people recovering from it. At least 95%+. The people not recovering from it are the same people that would also die from the normal flu.

          It really makes you wonder, or at least it should, what the politicians are up to when they shut states down for months, up to even 2 or 3, at a time, instead of taking it week by week to see how things play out.

          Bottom line is I know this virus is contagious and is probably more deadly than the flu, but with everything we know about it, we CAN go on with almost normal everyday life while still not killing people. I’m not saying open the borders up and let everyone in/out, but open the country up to those that need to get back to work to feed their families and pay their bills, and if someone tests positive, quarantine them!

      • #84
        Originally posted by Buckeyefan80;
        I am not comparing them to COVID even in regards to infectious. Just stating facts. I can compare it to the 1957 and 1968 flu pandemics, as those were just as infectious. Is it REALLY more serious when taking everything into consideration? Let's throw out the fact that the numbers are not going to be accurate because cases were missed in the beginning and cases could be incorrectly counted due to CDC guidelines of counting suspected cases. In the 1957 flu pandemic the death per capita was roughly 6.77, in 1968 pandemic it was around 4.98, and so far COVID is coming in at 2.8. For this to overtake the 1968 flu it would need to become the second most deadly flu since the beginning of the 20th century. At the rate the counting is going now it will easily become the second most deadly flu in America. [/B
        Does anyone know what those would have in common? Answer: the only 2 flu pandemics where the people practiced social distancing and large gatherings were banned as well as closing certain businesses. Sound familiar??? One can easily argue the closings and social distancing is for sure working, but if it becomes the second most deadly flu pandemic in America, is it? Really? I know it may sound morbid to some, but why are we going to continue to keep things closed for a 2.8 death rate? I don't know about everywhere in America, so I can't speak to any of that, but in the County I live in drug overdose is up 50% from same time last year, while suicide is up 11% and domestic abuse reports are up 30%. So again, is it REALLY worth it? If you add all the car accidents that normally would've occurred into your normal flu numbers, I'd guess they are comparable.
        The flu epidemics of 1957 and 1968, achieved their high death rates, precisely because social-distancing and widespread lockdowns were never in place to contain the spread. Not sure where you got that 2.8% death rate, but just using that and we’re talking over 9,000,000 dead in the U.S. alone. the Who estimates a 3.5% death rate for Covid 19. The Chinese insist on 2.1%, while the Imperial College “brains” peg it at 1.9% - numbers that, naturally, can’t be known until the disease has run its course. The current rate at which the infected are dying we can know, and it stands at around 6% in the U.S. – that despite a widespread and crippling economic shut down – but what that final, per capita death rate will be depends on the appearance of an effective vaccine, and only a careful easing of social distancing and economic reopening.

        Comment


        • Buckeyefan80
          Buckeyefan80 commented
          Editing a comment
          We don’t know for fact the reason they were so high is due to not social distancing. They social distanced and locked down during the 1918 flu pandemic and it was the deadliest in America. The second wave was even deadlier than the first! This is what I’m trying to point out. NO ONE knows if social distancing is the right or wrong answer and if you want to say that you know 100% fact that it is, I direct you to the DEADLIEST flu pandemic in US history, where social distancing measures and lockdowns were used! If they had the medical knowledge then that we have now maybe so many people wouldn’t have died, but again, that is speculation. We will never know.

          Population of 331,000,000 million people in US. Roughly 93,000 deaths = 2.8% death rate per capita, as of now. The WHO can estimate all they want, I’ll never trust anything that comes from that organization. Yes, currently with the way the numbers are tracked it stands at 6%. Still does not justify a lockdown. I know it’s life and death we are talking about and not a bet, but I’d take a 99% chance of not dying any day of the week. I have more of a chance to be killed in a traffic accident! Even if I’m in the susceptible group, and it would depend which group I was in, I’d take a 94% chance of not dying. And those percentages are IF I even got the virus to begin with.

        • WJCJR
          WJCJR commented
          Editing a comment
          Maybe it’s the concept of “social-distancing” that eludes you. If you keep your distance from someone infected, or you give that person a big wet one – which you is more likely to become infected? How hard is that to grasp? Regarding the flu pandemic of 1918-19, the random “social distancing” measures nations adopted, were far too little and late, and the huge numbers of dead were the result of a second and third wave which hit with a mutated and more-virulent virus. And, given that we’re already at over 95,000 dead, what exactly is that 2.8% telling you? A month ago, using that same odd logic, your rate of American dead was 0.013%. As I’ve said, trying to project death numbers is a sucker’s game (which I was fool enough to try myself), as we won’t know a damn thing until the virus has run its course.

        • Seahawk Rick
          Seahawk Rick commented
          Editing a comment
          Added info...

          Columbia University put out a study today that said IF in the U.S. Social Distancing had been put into effect ONE WEEK earlier in March, 36,000 lives would have been saved. Our President thought it would go away like a miracle...Fake News.

          An AP Poll out today says 83% of Americans are very concerned opening up too early will lead to a rise in cases.

          WHO said 100,000 new cases were reported today, the most in one day since this all started.

          ***IF we had started stay at home and doing social distancing the first week of March like a number of scientists suggested to the White House, Columbia University says about 54,000 fewer people would have died...

          THIS illustrates how much worse it would be right now if we didn't start stay at home and social distancing when we did. The big brains don't make this crap up...But please, lets open it all up now and don't worry about what happens! The Covidiots have all the answers, just NONE of the PHD's to back them up. FREE to infect! Texas and Floriduuuuuh are the leaders among many others. Open, but do it at a walk, not the 100-meter dash!

          South Korea got it right and they had their first infections the same day we did. They had a playbook from SARS/MERS they offered us, but our fearless leader wanted to sweep it all under the rug and make it a secret so his precious stock market didn't tank. Like a miracle, its just going to go away...He had all the intelligence in December/January to know acting fast was the prudent thing to do, but he had none of the intelligence to do it.
          Last edited by Seahawk Rick; 05-21-2020, 09:47 PM.

      • #85
        "Maybe it’s the concept of “social-distancing” that eludes you. If you keep your distance from someone infected, or you give that person a big wet one – which you is more likely to become infected? How hard is that to grasp? Regarding the flu pandemic of 1918-19, the random “social distancing” measures nations adopted, were far too little and late, and the huge numbers of dead were the result of a second and third wave which hit with a mutated and more-virulent virus. And, given that we’re already at over 95,000 dead, what exactly is that 2.8% telling you? A month ago, using that same odd logic, your rate of American dead was 0.013%. As I’ve said, trying to project death numbers is a sucker’s game (which I was fool enough to try myself), as we won’t know a damn thing until the virus has run its course."

        I know exactly the concept of social distancing, boss. I can also grasp that the virus is infectious without even giving "a big wet one." The thing that you apparently don't realize, even by staying 6 feet apart, is we can social distance all we want for the next year, but if I am an asymptomatic carrier I can still pass it on to you, a long time from now. It is going to happen, whether tomorrow or 3 months from now. That is just the hard truth. You can't save everyone, sorry. I also know you apparently don't pay attention to percentages when it comes to survival rates. You just want to spew numbers of deaths, like the news. Pretty morbid if you ask me. Obviously, you are in the susceptible age group and don't want to interact with anyone. That is 100% OKAY!!! I will not criticize anyone that wants to stay inside nor anyone that wants to live their life. That is really what the whole debate is about for me, let people do what they want to do. Apparently you need to stay at home though, and also not let anyone around you. If you have grandkids and your kids want to bring them by make sure to tell them NO because they are probably infected, according to your numbers, and you will for sure die, according to your numbers. You don't want to get infected and then have a 100% chance of dying because the virus mutated. Seriously, I don't want you or anyone to die, but the way you make everything sound everyone is going to contract and then die with COVID because we will be the 1-6%.

        Not sure what my "odd logic" aka ACTUAL FACTS, AKA SHIT LIBS DON'T WANNA HEAR...has anything to do with the death rate. I was stating facts.All I was saying with the 2.8% is that is where we are as of this moment, to put this dumb shit into perspective with past flu pandemics. It will obviously change before all is said and done.

        Comment


        • #86

          Added info...

          Columbia University put out a study today that said IF in the U.S. Social Distancing had been put into effect ONE WEEK earlier in March, 36,000 lives would have been saved. Our President thought it would go away like a miracle...Fake News.
          This is the dumb stuff I'm talking about. For some reason so many people think the President can shut down and open the states and tell them what to do. The President can't! They do not have that authority. So blame your Governor for not social distancing "ONE WEEK earlier in March!" Even though the President shut down flights from China Jan 31. (Irrelevant, please don't make me defend him.)

          An AP Poll out today says 83% of Americans are very concerned opening up too early will lead to a rise in cases. The AP is obviously only polling people over 60 if they are getting those numbers...many people that don't even like Trump want to open.

          WHO said 100,000 new cases were reported today, the most in one day since this all started. Good thing they finally had enough tests to test 100,000 people. AYFKM!? This is stupid! FYI, there will be a spike in positive cases since Ohio opened and our immune system is compromised, thanks to Dewine.

          ***IF we had started stay at home and doing social distancing the first week of March like a good number of scientists suggested to the White House, Columbia University says about 54,000 fewer people would have died...Good thing you are not in the White House, since you don't even know what authority the White House, OR ANYONE, for that matter has. JC! Yes, this is stupid how many people don't know the law. This is why you will be bowing down to Dewine and the rest of them! The GOVERNOR's have control over the states, but please do tell everyone how it's Trump's fault...Please tell us who these scientists are also, Rick. I'm very curious.

          THIS illustrates how much worse it would be right now if we didn't start stay at home and social distancing when we did. The big brains don't make this crap up...WHO ARE THE BIG BRAINS, DO TELL...But please, lets open it all up now and don't worry about what happens! The Covidiots have all the answers, just NONE of the PHD's to back them up.(Still not sure which side is the "COVIDIOTS," I'm sorry, by not calling people names it is hard for me to determine which side I'm on...Not really, I know I'll NEVER be on the hateful Dem side AKA the people that Covidiots... a FREE to infect! Texas and Florida(Fixed it for ya...AGAIN) are the leaders among many others. Open, but do it at a walk, not the 100-meter dash! SEE ABOVE about THIS! Also, you apparently didn't get directed to the 1918 pandemic when you speculate... I don't see a "THIS" and You nor I know which way is the right way. You have the CHOICE to believe what you want and I have the CHOICE to believe what I want. Isn't that the right of free America?

          S
          outh Korea got it right and they had their fist infections the same day we did. They had a playbook from SARS/MERS they offered us, but our fearless leader wanted to sweep it all under the rug and make it a secret so his precious stock market didn't tank. Like a miracle, its just going to go away...He had all the intelligence in December/January to know acting fast was the prudent thing to do, but he had none of the intelligence to do it. If South Korea had it SO RIGHT, why did they have a "second wave?" Instead of making it about "our fearless leader," why don't you make it about
          Last edited by Seahawk Rick; 05-21-2020, 06:30 PM.

          This is seriously the dumb shit you all make me defend this dumbass because YOU think he is wrong



          Comment


          • #87
            IF the Good Lord wants me today,HE doesn't need Corona virus.....when your time is up,it's up, Virus,car wreck,heart attack,CA,,,and on and on...………..Let's open and get back to normal w/o FEAR(much of which cause by media. my 2 cents

            Comment


            • #88
              Originally posted by Buckeyefan80 View Post
              "Maybe it’s the concept of “social-distancing” that eludes you. If you keep your distance from someone infected, or you give that person a big wet one – which you is more likely to become infected? How hard is that to grasp? Regarding the flu pandemic of 1918-19, the random “social distancing” measures nations adopted, were far too little and late, and the huge numbers of dead were the result of a second and third wave which hit with a mutated and more-virulent virus. And, given that we’re already at over 95,000 dead, what exactly is that 2.8% telling you? A month ago, using that same odd logic, your rate of American dead was 0.013%. As I’ve said, trying to project death numbers is a sucker’s game (which I was fool enough to try myself), as we won’t know a damn thing until the virus has run its course."

              I know exactly the concept of social distancing, boss. I can also grasp that the virus is infectious without even giving "a big wet one." The thing that you apparently don't realize, even by staying 6 feet apart, is we can social distance all we want for the next year, but if I am an asymptomatic carrier I can still pass it on to you, a long time from now. It is going to happen, whether tomorrow or 3 months from now. That is just the hard truth. You can't save everyone, sorry. I also know you apparently don't pay attention to percentages when it comes to survival rates. You just want to spew numbers of deaths, like the news. Pretty morbid if you ask me. Obviously, you are in the susceptible age group and don't want to interact with anyone. That is 100% OKAY!!! I will not criticize anyone that wants to stay inside nor anyone that wants to live their life. That is really what the whole debate is about for me, let people do what they want to do. Apparently you need to stay at home though, and also not let anyone around you. If you have grandkids and your kids want to bring them by make sure to tell them NO because they are probably infected, according to your numbers, and you will for sure die, according to your numbers. You don't want to get infected and then have a 100% chance of dying because the virus mutated. Seriously, I don't want you or anyone to die, but the way you make everything sound everyone is going to contract and then die with COVID because we will be the 1-6%.

              Not sure what my "odd logic" aka ACTUAL FACTS, AKA SHIT LIBS DON'T WANNA HEAR...has anything to do with the death rate. I was stating facts.All I was saying with the 2.8% is that is where we are as of this moment, to put this dumb shit into perspective with past flu pandemics. It will obviously change before all is said and done.
              Hey – it wasn’t me that argued “social distancing” doesn’t work. It must’ve been some other covidiot. And comparing the entire 1918-19 Flu pandemic death rate of 6.8% with today’s Covid 19 rate of death of 2.8% is, at least “odd logic” if not pure covidiot BS. (And, it was you who said: “why are we going to continue to keep things closed for a 2.8 death rate?” Right?). It’s kind of like calling a total game score based on 1st quarter numbers. Well, that percentage has increased 300% since I began tracking Covid 19 deaths, and unless people suddenly stop dying, your bizarre faith in a Covid 19 2.8% lethality will undoubtedly be shaken. And, it may be “morbid” to focus on infections and deaths, but in the atmosphere of covidiot bullshit, to me it seems refreshing to face facts – and, who says I don’t track “survivability”.

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              Those are the current numbers. I had been posting them, but these – in fact – are more morbidly depressing than just the current death rates. It’s not rocket science to figure out why. Besides, national recovery numbers are wildly inconsistent, and based on widely varied reporting protocols, and I was uncomfortable having to own them as credible.

              And, I’m relieved to hear name-calling is done, but FYI, I’ve probably voted Republican for more years you’ve been alive (I just won’t vote “stupid”, no matter party allegiance). However, I guess I’m with the “SHIT LIBS” on this one, who “DON'T WANNA HEAR” the crap covidiots are spreading.


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              • #89
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                • Buckeyefan80
                  Buckeyefan80 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Can't say I can disagree with much that you said Rick. One thing he quite possibly gets a bad wrap for is the shutting down borders/flights. The first China flight restrictions in the world happened on Jan 24, only 1 week earlier, and it was only Asian and Pacific countries that restricted China travel. On Jan 31 he restricted flights from China to US citizens and their families only, which the US was one of the first, if not the first western country to do so, and the 23rd country in the world. At that time there were 6 confirmed cases, up from 2 on the 24th. Not sure anyone could foresee exactly how bad it was going to be at that time. The WHO had recognized it as a pandemic, but the last pandemic didn't require travel restrictions so it's hard to argue anyone knew. There are epidemiologists that say all the travel restrictions did was slow the spread (not sure I can totally agree with that). They say with a virus like this, once it's in the country travel restrictions make much less of a difference. Other people said that travel restrictions at that point probably doesn't make sense due to it spreading to several other countries. He could've cut off travel from everyone, but I'm not sure anyone knew the extent of the lethality at the time. There were also people saying that restricting travel too soon could have negative effects. Even saying restricting China travel could cause them to not report cases. Some health experts back in early March say that we have not seen any evidence that the restrictions stopped or slowed down the transmission of the virus. You say, "a real President would have realized the scope of the issue and at some point in February held a National Speech to lay out to the country all the science behind having an immediate social distancing plan to enact within a week." The thing about this is not even Italy, which was the first country to go into lockdown, didn't go into lockdown until March 9th. It's easy to criticize anyone now with all the info we have. All the expert health officials all the way until late Feb/early March were saying people were over-reacting and Fauci himself on March 8 was downplaying it and said masks should be reserved for healthcare workers. Fauci is the guy Trump is supposed to be listening to, so why would he lay a plan out in Feb. when none of the experts were saying he should? I don't think he should've ever brought any of his family into the Administration, and his so in law is a fuck that should be shot! He def fucked up with the supplies and for sure is all about the stock market, but at the same time, the stock market kinda tells the story of the economy. Doesn't every President want a good economy?/ Isn't that kinda the point of the nation? I think what's funny is that Obama would've done the same things in regards to restrictions and he would've been praised, but we will never know. Our country was doomed to be bankrupt the Day Wilson signed the Federal Reserve Act and has been on pace to a point of no return since the Reagan Admin, and 100% fact the "W" Admin made sure we would never come back, so he can feed the MIC. I'm sure the way things are going and definitely if he gets re-elected he will do more damage than the $10T damage Obama did. The difference is Obama didn't have to borrow $6T+ to hand out to citizens. You can add all the corporate money and dumb shit that was in the bills, but that's on the bill makers for even putting it in there and the POS Congress for allowing it.

                • Seahawk Rick
                  Seahawk Rick commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I can buy into him not acting on travel and social distancing in February as the virus was known to have gotten here already but he shut down the front door with China as the backdoor from Europe was wide open. The March 11th clusterfuck of a speech he gave from the oval on travel that turned things into chaos could have been the moment he became a President and said the country will have to do tough things and sacrifice to stem the tide of the virus plus say the Fed's would do everything they could to help get through the days to come with supplies and anything else deemed necessary to battle it. He didn't, and then went into ostrich mode. No President would have done things perfectly early, and deaths were gonna happen no matter what, but the total FU he gave to the states was mind boggling. He said he was a war time President at one point, but he showed he would have a tough time getting a girl scout meeting together. Mobilizing all the PPE for delivery and making sure companies in the U.S. stopped selling abroad, as was happening in March would have helped a ton. Testing and contact tracing, which helped South Korea squash it fast was just a dream here. He left it up to the states that had to fight each other for supplies and tests. He showed how putting people/cronies that don't know what the fuck they are doing in important jobs in a crisis gave it to the states without Vaseline. The usual blame everyone but himself dance is being played out again. He says the numbers of infections and deaths are phoney now and everyone is out to get him. We can't get him until Nov. 3rd unfortunately...Way too much time for him to screw up even more stuff. I hope there is something left for Biden to clean up...

                • Buckeyefan80
                  Buckeyefan80 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I hear ya man. The fact that contact tracing helped RSK and Japan (I read an article today that they used that from the get go) and some people in the US are so against it, tells us all we need to know about the state of our govt. So many people don’t trust them bc how shady all of them are. Many think they’ll use it as a form of bi brother, and how can we really blame them knowing how corrupt they all are? I know messed up by not blocking all travel, but I’m not sure any country really did this early on bc no one knew. Plus there were people saying it may be too early to shut down travel from just china, so imagine if travel was restricted from anywhere. There would’ve been uproar from everywhere. Like I’ve said before, I don’t listen to any of his speeches, but if what you are saying is all true then I can’t say I disagree with you. It’s funny that he talks about how they’re all out to get him tho, bc they are bc he knows how corrupt they all are and hopefully will expose it all if he loses in Nov or during his next term. But in all honesty, how the f*€k can the Dems put Biden up against him? I’m all for voting for a Dem if it’s a good choice. Biden is not a good choice. This has to be the first time in history of the US the VP didn’t run for Pres immediately after the 2nd term. That REALLY has to make you think WTF is up with the Dem party. They are a shady ass bunch for sure and the problem is no one will call them on it bc I’m sure it happens on both sides.
                  Last edited by Buckeyefan80; 05-24-2020, 12:16 PM.

              • #90
                Anytime Trump says something, I know that he is telling another lie. He is incapable of telling the truth. He never accepts blame for his mistakes, he searches for others to blame instead.

                Comment


                • Buckeyefan80
                  Buckeyefan80 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  This applies to anyone in office honestly.

                • Seahawk Rick
                  Seahawk Rick commented
                  Editing a comment
                  He lies about things he's said that are on video...He lies about his lies. They all lie, BUT not on the historic level of your average dictator...He is way above average on this one thing though, he'll leave the WH as the leader in bullshit spewed.
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